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Re: [VORTECcruisers] Cruise Control and Helms index is useless
74FJ40 restoration, BTB supplied 5.7L Vortec + 4L60E conversion.
Stock underseat tank, stock pickup and return locations.
BTB had supplied a Moroso in-line pump and 10 micron filter which
appeared to go bad.
> > The first time this happened (last Aug), I was on my way down to
BTB, on the 215
> > in Las Vegas, doing about 65 mph. I checked (and changed) the
fuel
> > filter (which was back by the (stock fj40) fuel tank.) After the
> > engine cooled down for a while, it started back up and ran.
It quit
> > again on the way back from BTB. When the engine dies it acts
> > *exactly* like I've run the truck out of fuel. I had 1/2 tank
when
> > this happened.
> >
> > I checked to ensure that I had the fuel tank plumbed correctly.
The
> > fuel supply line is 3/8", the return is 5/16".
> >
> > Thinking that perhaps Brian's MSD fuel pump had somehow
cavetated and
> > quit working correctly, we replaced it with the Edelbrock 1790
> > (http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_new/mc/fuel_pumps/
> > fuel_pumps_main.shtml).
(Yes, thats a lot of fuel pump.)
> > I tried to drive it from Las Vegas (thats my brother's house in the
> > last pic) to Long Beach to put it on a boat so I could ship it to
> > Hawaii, (where I live) and made it 20 miles. Ended up towing the
> > FJ40 back to Vegas.
> >
> > Thinking that perhaps the filter was introducing enough
pressure drop
> > to cause cavitation, we moved the filter to the pressure side of
the
> > pump. Simultaneously we replaced all the soft-lines on the
suction
> > side with "fuel injector" line.
> >
> > This actually made things worse (it quit within a few blocks.)
> >
> > Oddly, the fuel in the injector rail (the metal supply line that
> > comes over the back of the manifold and has the Schrader valve in
> it)
> > seems to have a lot of air (or gasoline that has (or is)
boiling) in
> > it when the problem occurs.
> >
> > Priming the engine with the fuel pump, (holding the Schrader valve
> > open until we get tons of fuel) cranking it, and then immediately
> > checking the Schrader again shows... air (or boiled fuel vapor).
> >
> > In the end, I had to leave the Land Cruiser in Las Vegas, and
return
> > to Hawaii. Subsequently, my brother (he builds 436 CI small block
> > chevys for drag racing) checked the screen on the regulator and
says
> > it looks clean.
Subsequent to that I received some advice to run two fuel pumps (a
high volume unit
connected to a surge tank, with this feeding the high-pressure pump.
So as it stands today this is what 'is':
Holley "Red" pump (volume) connected to 3/8" fuel line
Aluminum Surge tank connected to
a 4 psi fuel pressure regulator, which then tees into the return line
this keeps 4psi against the suction of the fuel pump
and
modified fitting coming out of the (aluminum) surge tank. Fitting
is now #8AN
(other two fittings on the surge tank are 1/4" NPT)
then
8AN to 10AN adapter
#10 fuel hose (stainless braided high pressure hose)
a very low pressure drop 10 micron in-line fuel filter
the Edelbrock 1790 fuel pump
#10AN elbow
#10 (both ends) check valve... this is important is it makes the
truck able to restart instantly (keeping the fuel from flashing
in the fuel rail)
3/8" high pressure fuel hose
fuel rail
All fuel system components are on pass side.
All exhaust components are on drivers side.
And, once again, after all that, it will run for a long time, 20-30
miles, then act like its running out of fuel and die.
Could be something in the tank floating around and eventually
covering the suction.
Could be the fuel getting hot enough to flash. (picking up heat each
time through the system, esp that big pump)
Could be that the wire running the fuel pump(s!), (which is the stock
vortec harness lead, so what, 22ga? 24ga?) getting
hot enough that the resistance goes way up, so voltage goes down, and
the fuel pump can no longer supply the volume/pressure
requirements of the engine.
Could be something else.
Jim
On Dec 30, 2005, at 1:11 PM, Ed Gilbert wrote:
> Since there many of us who are using stock tanks and inline fuel pumps
> with no problems
> whatsoever, there is very little likelihood that this is your problem.
> Since it has been several months
> since you first posted your problem, why don't you again describe your
> fuel and pump connections,
> along with the specific symptoms. I'm sure this is an easily-resolved
> problem; we just need to pin
> it down. I hate to see unnecessary parts changed/replaced, when
> simply
> identifying the problem area
> and fixing it will correct the malfunction.
>
> Ed
>
> Jim Thompson wrote:
>
> >
> > On Dec 29, 2005, at 6:01 PM, Nancy Swasey wrote:
> >
> > > One thing that is unique about my conversion that I haven't seen
> > > talked about here is my fuel pump. I used the in-tank fuel pump
> > > assembly from the donor vehicle. I was concerned about losing
> fuel
> > > pressure when rounding corners at speed ( I read about this in
> book
> > > by JTR Publishing, JTR stands for Jags that Run, the book is
> called
> > > Chevrolet TPI and TBI Engine Swapping). I also read several posts
> > > regarding fuel pump problems (not enough pressure, etc.) The
> > > factory unit has a bucket at the bottom of the pump unit that the
> > > return line feeds into so you can reuse that fuel as well as it
> > > functioning much like a baffle. I have run the tank down to 2
> > > gallons before and have never had a problem with cutting out while
> > > cornering. I cut a round hole in the top of my rear aftermarket
> > > tank using a jigsaw with metal cutting blade, then drilled and
> > > tapped screw holes to hold the unit in place. I was able to use
> > > the GM hoses and fittings up to where they become hard line for
> the
> > > feed, return, and vapor lines. At the hard line I cut the line
> and
> > > flared it using AN fittings to make the connection to bendable
> > > aluminum tubing for the rest of the new lines.
> >
> > I'm still having fuel problems on my 74 FJ40 (5.7L Vortec
> > conversion). Its either fuel starvation (as you allude above), or
> > the fuel is getting
> > so hot that the truck 'vapor locks' (though its happening now in a
> > 45F ambient). This would require that the fuel pump(s!) and the
> > trip to the engine and back 'heat' the fuel again and again until it
> > boils in the fuel rail (where its hottest, having just been through
> > both pumps and passed by the back of the engine (unavoidable).
> >
> > The problem is worse at 1/4 or lower.
> >
> > The next step is to go an aftermarket aux tank (eliminating the
> under-
> > the-passenger seat tank), with an in-tank AC-Delco fuel pump
> designed
> > for the Vortec application. I don't really mind getting the fuel
> > tank out of the cab anyway.
> >
> > Your post makes me think that I should perhaps re-visit the junk
> yard
> > and collect a gas tank out of a 97-98 GM/Chevy P/U and scavenge the
> > parts from its internals.
> >
> > Jim
> >
> >
> >
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